jfairladyz

I have no doubt in my mind that it can be set up better then the stock EFI. Thats not my point. My point is for what it would cost to switch to a 4-barrel setup you can convert to MS.


Batch fire is actually very good and very effective. Do you really need to tune the fuel to each individual cylinder??? Not unless you're trying to gain every last HP you can or trying to put out zero emissions. And as far as troubleshooting goes: sure there's more wiring, but that aside, there's really not much to trouble shoot. You've got a handful of sensors. With MS you have datalogging if you have a problem. So you can find out what part of the system is seeing the malfunction. Simple.


FI has actually been used in vehicles since1920.

without a means of feedback, a carb will never be able to do the same overall job that fuel injection can do.

the FI system doesnt draw enough power to put a strain on the electrical system. Most sensor and other parts only use 5V.

Yes, you made several good points. Comparing carbs to the stock FI, then the benefits dont weigh in either direction. Actually the stock FI gets the benefit due to the fact that its already there and replacing every part of the stock FI system wouldn't cost as much as the 4 barrel swap.

of course aftermarket EFI is still superior to both setups. I'm also thinking about going with an OBD II setup. Not as difficult as it may seem at first thought. Of course having a factory ECU tuned can get pricey. But I think it would all be worth it to have new car reliability, self-diagnosis (without a laptop hooked up) and all the parts are readily available in junkyards.

RodMoyes

I've just been kind awatching this thread and seeing what people had to say.

I personally, think it would be silly to do the 4bbl swap. I agree with all of the people who have argued in favor of the EFI set up. for my money, MegaSquirt is by far the best overall option. Carbs are for muscle cars. Just my $.02

Rod.

thxone

You know, I talked on the phone last night for several hours with my buddy JB's280z about the carb idea and it's like a brick wall whenever I bring up the carb swap with anyone....so what I am going to do is somehow bribe Silverhand to make me 2nd in command so I can change all your post in my favor.

But seriously, I am listening to all of your points and arguments and I will not just throw them by the way side. I am a firm beliver that if the majority swings one way it is usually with good reason most of the time. But like I said I haven't aquired alot of knowlege of different types of fuel injection systems least of all for the S130's. I still really want to do the carb thing but I will read up more and see if the MS a better way to go...for me. I tell you all what, if I do all this research and end up going with the Megasquirt and it works out for me then after I am made second in command on here you all get banned for 2 days!!!

WildmaN

Speaking of muscle cars, here is my '75 Firebird, which will hopefully get finished by me. She has the Cragar SS's, back on her now, these pics are a little older. But it gives me a chance to show you all, my baby I have had since '97.

thxone

I went to the Megasquirts site and read so much it made my eyes go crossed. I have only got two words to say about the Megasquirt...I would need a PHD in engineering to understand or comprehend most of what I read on those pages. There were a few terms I understood, like O2 sensor, injectors, fuel pump.....wait, no that's about it!!! Are you all telling me that when you read the manual for the MS that it all makes since to you? That does not seem to be written for the average joe to understand. Ok so that is more than two words..sorry.

Can someone break it down for me? It says I need to get certain parts and put this and that together and they keep throwing words like simple and easy and crap like that at me...how so? If you say it is plug and play then why do I need to do all this extra work??? So can someone give me a break down of what I need from the begining...I will start:

1. 1982 280zx
2. Megasquirt......please fill in the rest in simple terms as I have very little technical knowlege of terms. I am not trying to be an *** here I really don't understand most of what I read on the site. So if I got the MegaSquirt computer...what else do I need? Be gentle guys

lww

First, read this:

http://forums.hybridz.org/showthread.php?t=107467

Then, read this:

http://forums.hybridz.org/showthread.php?t=88246

thxone

Thats not funny lww!! ok it is a little...I guess there is more to read then, so I will see you all in about a month then when I finish all those links!! lol

lww

Actually, the two I posted are the one's you want, because they deal specifically with Z cars and although they are mostly focused on 1st gen cars, you'll need the same things for your S130 especially when compared to the FI from the 280Z.

The http://www.megasquirt.info site is not vehicle specific, so they have more theory than practical application which is what you are looking for.

Cheers,
LWW

entropy31

i'm not great at math, but i think that was more than 2 words.

thxone

I would say that second link was more helpful for sure...let me venture to ask these questions as I am still a little confused...

"MS = no AFM, yes or no? I can still use the stock injectors? Get rid of factory ECU and wiring? Make my own wiring? I purchase a few sensors? And this all will be between $200-$300? With tune-a-bility, increased performance and fuel economy?"

and if I do the carb setup...

"Carb setup = Manifold $200+ Carb $300+ Low pressure fuel pump$$?? New fuel lines $$?? custom air intake tube $40-$100 and a few other parts" somewhere near a grand and probably wont perform as well as the MS from what I am reading.

NismoPick

Nor as good as an L28ET... which you could prolly pick up for under $500.

As for the MS using an AFM.... correct, you don't need an AFM or MAF... it uses a MAP sensor (Manifold Absolute Pressure).

jfairladyz

The MS system wont end up being quite that cheap. You'll still have to buy the sensors. The final cost of the MS unit depends on which version you go with, who you buy it from, and whether or not you want to assemble the unit or buy it preassembled. If you're handy with soldering electronics and can follow schematics well then it shouldn't be too difficult.

Depending on which options you choose to incorporate (such as fast idle), and if you plan to reuse the stock injectors then overall cost will be fairly inexpensive.

Here's a couple of MS dealers to help you get an overall idea of the total cost to do the conversion.
http://www.diyautotune.com/catalog/index.php
http://www.rs-autosport.net/catalog/

thxone

Geee, you guys are swell. Thanks for those links J. In fact thanks to everyone that has offered help in expanding my knowlege. I think I should have enough info to keep me busy and to make some informed decisions. I am still reading info so it will be a bit before I completely make a final decision.

lww

Having done all of them, carbs, carbed turbo, FI, FI turbo on my cars and with others, I can say without reservation, of all the solutions, you will get more tuneability, better performance and significantly better fuel efficiency with a MegaSquirt system over ANY carb setup.

The first one is always the most difficult. Once you get over that first one and you have a good understanding of how everything works together, it is very simple.

jfairladyz

I've got a whole bunch megasquirt links handy if you need any more information. I have them all bookmarked from my own megasquirt research

frank280zx

MS will give you in the right tune 30 miles to the gallon .... i am pro MsS all the way !

lww

Frank has spoken! All bow down before the Mighty Frank!

Seriously, for the same money you'd spend on the carb setup, you can have your cake and eat it too...

30 mpg on a 280ZX is very much doable with a stand alone programmable ECU.

Can you imagine going nearly 500 miles on a single tank of gas?! That would last me nearly a WHOLE week before I had to fill up again!

Not counting all the other side benefits, like smooth and improved power output, in town driveability.

Then, when you upgrade ANYTHING, you can simply run the data logger for 20 or 30 miles and tweak it to take advantage of whatever you've done and KNOW through the data logging exactly what it has changed in your engine. Unlike carbs where you're constantly turning screws and adjusting jets.

MSnS=See it, adjust it and drive!

thxone

Well I guess that settles it....MSS then.