No Spark
12-30-2009, 02:41 PM
#1
Intrawebz Wizard
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No Spark
Ok after bypassing the stupid auto tranny start system all togeather (wired to the key switch via relay) The Z now turns over! Wooo! But No spark at ALL Everything is hooked up and grounded I think But still no spark at all... all 6 packs wont even give a little static zap.
I'm honestly stumped.... What could I be missing?
I'm honestly stumped.... What could I be missing?
12-30-2009, 03:36 PM
#3
Intrawebz Wizard
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PTU and CAS are fine. ptu is second gen and hooked up correctly and I never touched the cas other then removing the connector but I'll double check anyways.
EDIT: And no I haven't been told about the old VS new PTU but I did some reading on it before hand thankfully lol
Edit#2: PTU and CAS are fine after testing them again
EDIT: And no I haven't been told about the old VS new PTU but I did some reading on it before hand thankfully lol
Edit#2: PTU and CAS are fine after testing them again
Last edited by BlueKitsune; 12-30-2009 at 03:50 PM.
12-30-2009, 09:02 PM
#4
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I'm drawing at straws here but could the following possibly be stopping you from getting it to roll over.
I have no idea and im just guestimating but maybe something along the lines there is stopping it from sparking.
1. Shiftlock ? (it was stick so could be an issue?)
2. The ECU not reading the car is in park or that your gear is "N"
3. Software between the ECU on a stick and auto is different and a sensor somewhere is not sending the message to the coilpacks.
4. Does the fuel pump initalize when you turn the key? (just curious) Do the cylinders get gas in them?
5. Does the check engine light on the dash go out after you wait a few seconds (assuming your ok here also)
6. Have you checked all of your fuse's (dumb but probably something electrical telling it not to spark)
7. Is the ECU in diagnostic mode?
Remember to the check near the consult under the drivers side and under the hood... again just trying to stab at locations for no spark.
I have no idea and im just guestimating but maybe something along the lines there is stopping it from sparking.
1. Shiftlock ? (it was stick so could be an issue?)
2. The ECU not reading the car is in park or that your gear is "N"
3. Software between the ECU on a stick and auto is different and a sensor somewhere is not sending the message to the coilpacks.
4. Does the fuel pump initalize when you turn the key? (just curious) Do the cylinders get gas in them?
5. Does the check engine light on the dash go out after you wait a few seconds (assuming your ok here also)
6. Have you checked all of your fuse's (dumb but probably something electrical telling it not to spark)
7. Is the ECU in diagnostic mode?
Remember to the check near the consult under the drivers side and under the hood... again just trying to stab at locations for no spark.
Last edited by cpuhost; 12-30-2009 at 09:06 PM.
12-30-2009, 09:08 PM
#5
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he's not having an issue getting it to turn over.... he's having an issue getting spark. meaning: it turns over, but doesn't get spark -> doesn't run.
turning over = starter is turning engine OR the engine is running. generally the term is used to describe the starter turning the engine.
spark = spark at the spark plugs, generally promoting ->
running = the engine is running.
all cleared up?
turning over = starter is turning engine OR the engine is running. generally the term is used to describe the starter turning the engine.
spark = spark at the spark plugs, generally promoting ->
running = the engine is running.
all cleared up?
12-30-2009, 09:42 PM
#6
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I'm pretty sure the ECU controls if the spark is fired or not and some systems can stop that from happening because of the above mentioned reasons. (safety / failsafe)
Even though he has the starter cranking the motor over that does not mean that the ecu has initalized the rest of the systems to feed fuel into the engine and control the ptu/cas and yes, spark.
I'm not saying i know alot about the vehicle, im just simply trying to help the poster approach the problem objectively since it was a swap from a STICK to Automatic he may need to look at other factors that were not there before.
Overdrive was present / shiftlock etc. Now maybe the ECU is stopping the sparking all together.
He did however "Ok after bypassing the stupid auto tranny start system all togeather "
Last edited by cpuhost; 12-30-2009 at 09:45 PM.
12-30-2009, 11:10 PM
#7
Intrawebz Wizard
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ITs getting fuel, I can smell it (no exhaust) and the ECU CAS PTU are all fine. just no spark
And it used to be an auto, but its a 5 speed now, and I bypassed 100% of the old auto trans safety start system. Maybe thats the problem? but its getting fuel and not spark, shoulding it be the other way around if it was in safety mode or w/e?
And it used to be an auto, but its a 5 speed now, and I bypassed 100% of the old auto trans safety start system. Maybe thats the problem? but its getting fuel and not spark, shoulding it be the other way around if it was in safety mode or w/e?
12-30-2009, 11:58 PM
#8
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ITs getting fuel, I can smell it (no exhaust) and the ECU CAS PTU are all fine. just no spark
And it used to be an auto, but its a 5 speed now, and I bypassed 100% of the old auto trans safety start system. Maybe thats the problem? but its getting fuel and not spark, shoulding it be the other way around if it was in safety mode or w/e?
And it used to be an auto, but its a 5 speed now, and I bypassed 100% of the old auto trans safety start system. Maybe thats the problem? but its getting fuel and not spark, shoulding it be the other way around if it was in safety mode or w/e?
not that this matters now but:
http://www.twinturbo.net/nissan/300z...rterrelay.html
http://www.twinturbo.net/nissan/300z...es/autohp.html
"There were always different ECU's for manual and auto cars. "
I wish i could provide more help but unfortunately i cant.
12-31-2009, 01:08 AM
#9
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The first philosophical imperative is to not speak about things of which you have no knowledge. Sometimes bad responses are worse than none at all.
An automatic ECU will work fine in a manual Z, but not the other way around. The difference in the programs is the information regarding transmission control... on the manual Zs, this information is simply ignored.
I'll think about the problem and post back later if I come up with anything.
Quick edit: How did you test for spark? Did you remove a plug and crank the engine while grounding the base?
An automatic ECU will work fine in a manual Z, but not the other way around. The difference in the programs is the information regarding transmission control... on the manual Zs, this information is simply ignored.
I'll think about the problem and post back later if I come up with anything.
Quick edit: How did you test for spark? Did you remove a plug and crank the engine while grounding the base?
Last edited by ZLover4Life; 12-31-2009 at 01:19 AM.
12-31-2009, 11:49 AM
#10
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And I already knew the ECU was fine, but I know the harness has been spliced into like 50 million times BUT the car did run with this harness beforehand so I know it works
12-31-2009, 07:06 PM
#11
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I know you said you checked the PTU, but how are its connectors? Corrosion on the leads could cause a problem of this sort.
To be honest, the fact that none of them are firing suggests to me that you probably have grounds missing on the harness. There are multiple ground points on the plenum (you'll see little bolt holes that just stick up)... make sure each of them has a ground wire attached.
To be honest, the fact that none of them are firing suggests to me that you probably have grounds missing on the harness. There are multiple ground points on the plenum (you'll see little bolt holes that just stick up)... make sure each of them has a ground wire attached.
12-31-2009, 07:14 PM
#12
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I know you said you checked the PTU, but how are its connectors? Corrosion on the leads could cause a problem of this sort.
To be honest, the fact that none of them are firing suggests to me that you probably have grounds missing on the harness. There are multiple ground points on the plenum (you'll see little bolt holes that just stick up)... make sure each of them has a ground wire attached.
To be honest, the fact that none of them are firing suggests to me that you probably have grounds missing on the harness. There are multiple ground points on the plenum (you'll see little bolt holes that just stick up)... make sure each of them has a ground wire attached.
For now lets say I didn't miss a ground (sense I have no idea if I did and Im not gonna go check on new years eve), what would I look for then?
12-31-2009, 10:20 PM
#15
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As an idea, get a timing light... there is a black wire that loops out of the PTU harness for the signal - clip the timing light to that. Have someone crank the engine and see if the timing light strobes. If it doesn't, you'll know the PTU isn't sending a signal to the coils... I'm not exactly sure how valuable that information will be (as I honestly think, based on the symptoms, that the PTU is not sending a signal, so this would just be confirmation of what I already suspect), but it could tell us if the signal loss is between the PTU and coils (i.e. a ground in the harness).
12-31-2009, 10:43 PM
#16
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As an idea, get a timing light... there is a black wire that loops out of the PTU harness for the signal - clip the timing light to that. Have someone crank the engine and see if the timing light strobes. If it doesn't, you'll know the PTU isn't sending a signal to the coils... I'm not exactly sure how valuable that information will be (as I honestly think, based on the symptoms, that the PTU is not sending a signal, so this would just be confirmation of what I already suspect), but it could tell us if the signal loss is between the PTU and coils (i.e. a ground in the harness).
01-01-2010, 12:25 AM
#19
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Don't worry, most Z32 owners don't even know that. Many sit there trying it on the #1 coil pack wires wondering why they're not getting a strong enough signal (only a *really* sensitive timing light will pick up a signal from the coil wires).
01-01-2010, 12:29 AM
#20
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Well that makes me feel better lol Alright if it wasn't -5F here. I probably would go work on that Z cuz honestly, Im nearly bored into a stupor right now
01-01-2010, 06:36 AM
#21
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First off, did you even read my post? I'm here to discuss Z's not be blasted for TRYING to help people out with a vehicle that i love owning.
I'm pretty sure the ECU controls if the spark is fired or not and some systems can stop that from happening because of the above mentioned reasons. (safety / failsafe)
Even though he has the starter cranking the motor over that does not mean that the ecu has initalized the rest of the systems to feed fuel into the engine and control the ptu/cas and yes, spark.
I'm not saying i know alot about the vehicle, im just simply trying to help the poster approach the problem objectively since it was a swap from a STICK to Automatic he may need to look at other factors that were not there before.
Overdrive was present / shiftlock etc. Now maybe the ECU is stopping the sparking all together.
He did however "Ok after bypassing the stupid auto tranny start system all togeather "
I'm pretty sure the ECU controls if the spark is fired or not and some systems can stop that from happening because of the above mentioned reasons. (safety / failsafe)
Even though he has the starter cranking the motor over that does not mean that the ecu has initalized the rest of the systems to feed fuel into the engine and control the ptu/cas and yes, spark.
I'm not saying i know alot about the vehicle, im just simply trying to help the poster approach the problem objectively since it was a swap from a STICK to Automatic he may need to look at other factors that were not there before.
Overdrive was present / shiftlock etc. Now maybe the ECU is stopping the sparking all together.
He did however "Ok after bypassing the stupid auto tranny start system all togeather "
LOL! dude i'm just trying to clear up improperly used terms. yes i read your post, and i was not flaming you. you were mixed up, i cleared up the confusion. chill man.
01-01-2010, 02:42 PM
#22
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Well I checked the grounds with an ohm meter. everything seems to be grounded out and I did the test with the timing light. No single at all. And the connectors are fine and clean...
I'm going to guess either the PTU is somehow shot. Or theres a short in the EFI harness?
I'm going to guess either the PTU is somehow shot. Or theres a short in the EFI harness?
01-01-2010, 03:23 PM
#23
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I can't find it in my brief scanning and I'm too lazy at the moment to search (all nighter last night), but didn't you mention that this harness was all hacked up from previous work? I've seen harnesses that appeared to be in working order but simply had **** connections that resulted in the car running on 3 cylinders... and at that point, the easiest solution was a new EFI harness.
01-01-2010, 04:15 PM
#24
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I think most people pulled an all nighter last night lol
And ya the harness is an N/A Harness that looks like its be hacked up about 500 times but it worked before I pulled the engine to change the tranny for a 5 speed. but maybe something broke free is the mess of connectors somewhere and ruined it.
Side note, I did remove an alarm system but it didn't seem to be hooked into any wires other then some power wires to run it, Tho its there any wires int eh drivers dash area that can affect the ptu signal?
And ya the harness is an N/A Harness that looks like its be hacked up about 500 times but it worked before I pulled the engine to change the tranny for a 5 speed. but maybe something broke free is the mess of connectors somewhere and ruined it.
Side note, I did remove an alarm system but it didn't seem to be hooked into any wires other then some power wires to run it, Tho its there any wires int eh drivers dash area that can affect the ptu signal?
01-01-2010, 05:57 PM
#25
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No, there shouldn't be. What alarm system was it? Factory or aftermarket?
And I still think you should replace the EFI harness... using a hacked up one will only cause trouble down the line. Tell your "customer" that it's imperative to the car running, thus an expense he must incur.
And I still think you should replace the EFI harness... using a hacked up one will only cause trouble down the line. Tell your "customer" that it's imperative to the car running, thus an expense he must incur.
